April 2014 in the PNW

[ningit]

the heavier tri-atomic molecules pool and condense in the convective eddies. 

 

??? Water has three atoms, but I'm not sure what you mean by this.

[Phil]

Never said impossible. Never. I said I know its very possible in fact.

 

But not sustainable. Not for 11 days at 3,000 feet in elevation! That is just common sense.

The July 2013 event was very anomalous in the sense that it occurred after we'd had over 20" of rain in 3 weeks, and featured a strong capping inversion hence none of the typical towering cumulus.

 

So not only was transpiration elevated due to the lush vegetation, but the ground was saturated. Dewpoints would sit in the mid 70s during the day, rise to about 80 during the evening, then drop down to about 70 by dawn with thick fog developing by 12-1am.

 

I can consider the possibility that my station was possibly reading too high on the dewpoint, but I'm not making this s**t up. Seriously..I don't do that.

[TT-SEA]

McHenry, MD highs for July 2013:

 

1-71

2-75

3-78

4-78

5-78

6-80

7-75

8-73

9-73

10-78

11-69

12-66

13-73

14-80

15-80

16-82

17-82

18-82

19-82

20-75

21-73

22-75

23-73

24-62

25-68

26-73

27-68

28-69

29-66

30-69

31-69

 

 

It is impossible to have 11-days of 80-degree dewpoints in there.     There were only 7 days total with a high above 80.   

 

Rule:   DEWPOINT TEMPERATURE CANNOT EXCEED AIR TEMPERATURE.  

[Phil]

McHenry, MD highs for July 2013:

 

1-71

2-75

3-78

4-78

5-78

6-80

7-75

8-73

9-73

10-78

11-69

12-66

13-73

14-80

15-80

16-82

17-82

18-82

19-82

20-75

21-73

22-75

23-73

24-62

25-68

26-73

27-68

28-69

29-66

30-69

31-69

 

 

That is not a hot month!

 

And it is impossible to have 11-days of 80-degree dewpoints in there.

What station are you using? Looks like it's this one: http://m.weatherbug.com/MD/McHenry-weather/local-weather/current-conditions/K2G4?units=English&wndunits=MPH

 

Deemed "unreliable" by NCDC. It currently says the dewpoint here is 4 degrees.

 

Why do you play this game? What's in it for you?

[Phil]

Rule: DEWPOINT TEMPERATURE CAN EXCEED AIR TEMPERATURE.

This is why you need to take a physics class. You're living in a fairytale.

[TT-SEA]

This is why you need to take a physics class. You're living in a fairytale.

 

 

Mistyped... fixed now.   No game here.   Your equipment sucks or you like to add a little drama for fun.    Probably both.    No big deal.       

[TT-SEA]

Peak temperature for the month of July there was 82 degrees.    Many days with highs in the 60s.   

 

That is a actually a chilly July even by our standards out here.    You are telling Jim how hot it was there... and it was actually warmer here.  

[Phil]

I think I see what you're attempting to do. Trying to be "cool" to make up for your constant complaining. People have had enough of you in that regard, so you're resorting to the "Phil's lying" distraction.

[Phil]

Peak temperature for the month of July was 82 degrees.

 

MANY days with highs in the 60s.

 

That is a actually a chilly July even by our standards out here!

 

You are telling Jim how hot it was there... and it was actually warmer here.

Link me to the station you're using. It looks like this one, which has been deemed unreliable by NCDC: http://m.weatherbug.com/MD/McHenry-weather/local-weather/current-conditions/K2G4?units=English&wndunits=MPH

 

Again, look at the current dewpoint reading! It's reading 4 degrees right now! Physically impossible.

 

Why do you think NCDC decides not to factor in this station? It's a piece of dogs**t.

[TT-SEA]

I think I see what you're attempting to do. Trying to be "cool" to make up for your constant complaining. People have had enough of you in that regard, so you're resorting to the "Phil's lying" distraction.

 

   Right.

 

First you have to have 11 days with a high temp above 80 degrees to even make it possible to have 11 straight days of 80-degree dewpoints.   Even that simple thing did not happen.    And even with 11 days with a high above 80... 11 straight days of 80-degree dewpoints just does not happen at 3,000 feet.

[Phil]

Mistyped. Fixed now.

Why don't you come down to the next APS meeting and lecture all us physicists on the dewpoint-temperature relationship?

 

I'll bet you don't even know why the dewpoint cannot exceed the ambient temperature.

[ningit]

What did you mean by the triatomic thing?

[Phil]

 

Right.

 

You live at 3,000 feet in elevation. A child can understand basic meteorology.

 

First you have to have 11 days with a high temp above 80 degrees to even make it possible to have 11 straight days of 80-degree dewpoints! Even that simple thing did not happen.

 

And even with 11 days with a high above 80... 11 straight days of 80-degree dewpoints just does not happen at 3,000 feet.

You're making up data. Link me to whatever station you're deriving these values from.

[TT-SEA]

Why don't you come down to the next APS meeting and lecture all us physicists on the dewpoint-temperature relationship?

 

I'll bet you don't even know why the dewpoint cannot exceed the ambient temperature.

 

Air saturation cannot exceed 100%.   Pretty simple.

 

Why don't you submit your amazing 11-day streak of 80-degree dewpoints at 3,000 feet in a relatively cool month.  

[Phil]

Air saturation cannot exceed 100%. Simple math.

 

Pretty simple.

 

Why don't you submit your amazing 11-day streak of 80-degree dewpoints at 3,000 feet in a relatively cool month.

What defines air-saturation? At what point does an airmass become saturated?

 

Answer that question, and you can debate this with me.

[TT-SEA]

You're making up data. Link me to whatever station you're deriving these values from.

 

 

Did not make up the numbers obviously.    Don't even need to look at the dewpoint... you only had 7 days with a high above 80 degrees last July.    

 

http://www.wunderground.com/cgi-bin/findweather/hdfForecast?query=mchenry+md

[Phil]

What did you mean by the triatomic thing?

H2^O is a tri-atomic molecule. It's significantly heavier than the more common N^2 O^2 molecules, and very dampened within the Coulomb force.

[Phil]

Really??

 

How does this matter when you only had 7 days with a high above 80 degrees last July? Simple math.

Utter bulls**t. At least half of the days were between 85-91F. I'll take a picture of the data if you want.

[TT-SEA]

Its like arguing with Bill Clinton.   Define 'is'.  

[Phil]

Hey Phil... I had 12 straight days with a dewpoint above 80 degrees last summer.

 

You can't prove me wrong!

 

So stupid.

 

Its like arguing with Bill Clinton. Define 'is'.

Again, want pictures? I'll do it right now if you want.

[TT-SEA]

Utter bulls**t. At least half of the days were between 85-91F. I'll take a picture of the data if you want.

 

 

Oakland station also had 7 days above 80 with a peak of 82.   

 

Your area is paradise in the summer now that I am looking at the details.

[ningit]

Yeah, I was just looking at the Oakland station too. It was cooler than Phil was describing, yet his house is hundreds of feet higher in elevation. It does seem weird, right?

[Phil]

Here. Apparently my memory was off, highest dewpoint was 78 degrees. Could have sworn it got higher.

 

And yes I'm aware the time-date-year is off. I haven't re-set it since we lost power last summer and it went back to 2005, which was the year I bought it:

 

http://catchmypicture.com/f/NgwAFt/800.jpg

[TT-SEA]

Here. Apparently my memory was off, highest dewpoint was 78 degrees. Could have sworn it got higher:

 

http://catchmypicture.com/f/NgwAFt/800.jpg

 

Yeah... and that was in 2011.    

[Phil]

Yeah... and that was in 2011.

 

Yet you had 11 straight days of 80-degree dewpoints last July????

Read my post. The date is 2 years and 2 months off. We lost power and it reconfigured itself back to 2005 which was the year I bought it. I tried to recalibrate it but didn't finish.

 

I can change it now and take another pic if you so desire.

[Phil]

Here's what it says now..see the date...way off:

 

http://catchmypicture.com/f/tn2GBC/800.jpg

[TT-SEA]

Read my post. The date is 2 years and 2 months off. We lost power and it reconfigured itself back to 2005 which was the year I bought it. I tried to recalibrate it but didn't finish.

 

I can change it now and take another pic if you so desire.

 

 

Wait... so you are saying it was 97 degrees outside last July there?    When I can't find a station ever getting above the low 80s the entire month? 

[Phil]

Yeah... and that was in 2011.

 

Yet you had 11 straight days of 80-degree dewpoints last July????

 

Actually that says 97 degrees outside with 100% humidity. That would be a 97-degree dewpoint. And that my friend would be a WORLD RECORD!

 

Thought the record was on the Persian Gulf... but no it was at 3,000 feet in the mountains of Maryland!

 

OK.

 

 

Your equipment SUCKS dude.

The temp was not 97 with 100% humidity. Those readings occurred at different times..I selected "Hi" which = the highest reading in every category within the span of that month.

 

The humidity gets to 100% here every night during the summer as temps cool to the dewpoint which is always elevated given upslope flow.

[Phil]

Wait... so you are saying it was 97 degrees outside last July there??? When I can't find a station ever getting above the low 80s the entire month??

 

97 degrees there last July huh?? With 100% humidity to boot! World record dewpoint right there buddy!

 

The 78-degree dewpoint is inside your house... where its 80 degrees with humidity of 91%.

 

Outside it 97 degrees with a dewpoint of 97 degrees and humidity of 100%.

 

This needs to verified by the world record people because this is HUGE.

The vantage pro 2 doesn't measure indoor dewpoint, you dolt. The sensors are outside. The indoor temp gets artificially high when the backlight is turned on.

 

And, I've told you not to use the crappy, unreliable stations in GCA. They're showing dewpoints right now of 0-4F. Hence NCDC rules them *unreliable*. You need to get your act together.

[TT-SEA]

The vantage pro 2 doesn't measure indoor dewpoint, you dolt. The sensors are outside. The indoor temp gets artificially high when the backlight is turned on.

 

 

How did you have 11 straight days of dewpoints above 80 degrees when your peak dewpoint was 78?       

 

Last July was pretty cool there overall  

[Phil]

The dewpoint shown is inside your house.

 

And it did not get up to 97 degrees there last July. You must have put the sensor in the sun. You did not get above the low 80s.

Huh? Google it dude, the vantage pro 2 only measures outdoor dewpoints. Seriously what's the matter with you? Facts don't seem to deter you.

 

And for the gazillionth time, I've warned you about using these stations, ruled "unreliable" by NCDC. Their data is bunk..look at the current dewpoint reading...4 degrees: http://m.weatherbug.com/MD/McHenry-weather/local-weather/current-conditions/K2G4

[TT-SEA]

Can't describe my excitement to have 3 or 4 dry, warm days coming up...

 

http://www.ecmwf.int/products/forecasts/d/getchart/catalog/products/forecasts/medium/deterministic/msl_uv850_z500!Geopotential%20500%20hPa%20and%20Temperature%20at%20850%20hPa!144!North%20America!pop!od!oper!public_plots!2014042500!!chart.gif

[Phil]

Its in the box.

 

How did you have 11 straight days of dewpoints above 80 degrees when your peak dewpoint was 78?

 

Either way... your equipment sucks.

 

Last July was pretty cool there.

Apparently my memory was off by 2-3 degrees. Oh noes!

 

July 2013 was terrible here with several highs into the 90s. That I remember, and my data confirms it.

 

You're making s**t up and/or using BS data.

[TT-SEA]

Huh? Google it dude, the vantage pro 2 only measures outdoor dewpoints. Seriously what's the matter with you? Facts don't seem to deter you.

 

And for the gazillionth time, I've warned you about using these stations, ruled "unreliable" by NCDC. Their data is bunk..look at the current dewpoint reading...4 degrees: http://m.weatherbug.com/MD/McHenry-weather/local-weather/current-conditions/K2G4

 

 

What is wrong with me??    Just saying that you did not have 11 straight days with 80-degree dewpoints last summer.  Or ever.

 

It was wrong.    No debate.   

 

And for the record... last July was a pretty cool month there.    And your area is summer heaven really... that is why so many tourists from lower elevations go there in the summer.  

[TT-SEA]

Apparently my memory was off by 2-3 degrees. Oh noes!

 

July 2013 was terrible here with several highs into the 90s. That I remember, and my data confirms it.

 

You're making s**t up and/or using BS data.

 

 

Show me one valid station near you with several highs in the 90s last July.   

[Phil]

What is wrong with me??

 

You did not have 11 straight days with 80-degree dewpoints last summer.

 

Or ever.

As I showed you, they peaked in upper 70s. So yes my recollection was off a few degrees.

 

And for the record... last July was a pretty cool month there. And your area is summer heaven really... that is why so many tourists from lower elevations go there in the summer.

Last July was horrifically humid with highs into the 90s. There were also several severe storms, hence the high wind reading.

[Phil]

Show me one valid station near you with several highs in the 90s last July.

 

Do it.

I just showed you my station. Then you claimed it was "off" based on data that NCDC has deemed unreliable.

 

Give it up. I admitted my memory was a bit off, now it's your turn to recant on the absurdities you've put forth here tonight.

[TT-SEA]

I just showed you my station. Then you claimed it was "off" based on data that NCDC has deemed unreliable.

 

Give it up. I admitted my memory was a bit off, now it's your turn to recant on the absurdities you've put forth here tonight.

 

 

Your station?  That is the problem.   You did not hit 97 degrees last July. 

 

I want another station close to you that had several highs in the 90s last July... or even one 90-degree reading.   I keep looking though stations and they all peaked in the low to mid 80s for the month. 

[Phil]

Your station??? That is the problem! You did not hit 97 degrees last July. Pure and simple. Your equipment sucks.

 

I want another station close to you that had several highs in the 90s last July.

 

I keep looking though stations and they all peaked in the low to mid 80s for the month. I can't find one station showing even one day of 90 degrees the entire month in your area.

 

You're using a station that NCDC has determined to be malfunctioning...and currently is reading a 4 degree dewpoint..lol. I can tell you that station is worthless.

 

Link the stations you're using. Let's go through all the data. I have a feeling that you're looking at the two malfunctioning stations I showed you.

 

Follow the weather here this summer..you'll see that I'm not BSing you.

[Phil]

My wife is nagging me to turn off my iphone and go to bed. Let's continue this through PM tomorrow.