Politer Politics

[Thermal Trough]

9 minutes ago, Slushy Inch said:

And on childcare. JD said some women want to stay home more or less when they have a child and they want choice. That’s not a reason to not support paid family leave. 72 percent of Republicans support paid family leave. Just support it. Walz actually did it on Minnesota, that was a w.

The USA needs to adopt the European Union model. The EU law requires a minimum of 14 weeks of maternity leave, with two weeks of compulsory leave before or after childbirth. Some countries have longer leaves though and the average maternity leave across the EU is 21 weeks. I think 14 weeks would be a good federal standard and then you can allow states to add on to it if they want.

[TT-SEA]

6 minutes ago, Thermal Trough said:

I would love to see Harris and Trump debate one final time. Harris already accepted the CNN debate for October 23. I hope Trump accepts.

I hope so too but it would be a bad decision for the Republicans.  Trump would fail miserably in trying to do as good as Vance and he would be hurt by the contrast.  

[Slushy Inch]

1 minute ago, Thermal Trough said:

The USA needs to adopt the European Union model. The EU law requires a minimum of 14 weeks of maternity leave, with two weeks of compulsory leave before or after childbirth. Some countries have longer leaves though and the average maternity leave across the EU is 21 weeks. I think 14 weeks would be a good federal standard and then you can allow states to add on to it if they want.

Agreed 

[Hoosier]

This felt like a debate from the pre-Trump era.  So much civility.

Walz looked nervous and stiff at the beginning but then loosened up.  Vance came across as likable, which has been an issue for him of course.  I thought one of Walz's better moments was toward the end of the debate with the 2020 election stuff.  

Overall, this debate seems like it's pretty much a wash.  The Trump-Harris debate really didn't cause a lasting material change in the polling, so I can't imagine this one will.  

[Slushy Inch]

Question on the Middle East should have been how will you deescalate not should we do a preemptive strike. God the corporate media is awful.

[SilverFallsAndrew]

6 minutes ago, Thermal Trough said:

The USA needs to adopt the European Union model. The EU law requires a minimum of 14 weeks of maternity leave, with two weeks of compulsory leave before or after childbirth. Some countries have longer leaves though and the average maternity leave across the EU is 21 weeks. I think 14 weeks would be a good federal standard and then you can allow states to add on to it if they want.

As long as it’s not extended to men. I’ll take two weeks off when my kid is born, but anything beyond that is excessive for a father. 

[Groundhog]

1 hour ago, TT-SEA said:

You forgot what it's like to have a sane and respectful person arguing for your side!    Isn't it nice?   I could vote for JD for president.    

F*ck Trump.

You posted about how wonderful it is to see the candidates engage in civil debate. And you post this in the same evenings.  Is this a rules-for-thee-and-not-for-me moment?

[Hoosier]

Question.  What state is Walz from again?  It's Minnesota, right?  I'm not sure if he mentioned it.  

[Thermal Trough]

9 minutes ago, Groundhog said:

Trump invited her to debate on Fox. She declined. 

Oh where did you hear that? I heard it was Trump who was holding up a Fox debate. This is according to Bret Baier.

https://thehill.com/homenews/media/4898291-bret-baier-trump-not-harris-debate-holdup-fox-news

[TT-SEA]

Just now, Groundhog said:

You posted about how wonderful it is to see the candidates engage in civil debate. And you post this in the same evenings.  Is this a rules-for-thee-and-not-for-me moment?

Absolutely when it comes to Trump.    He deserves every ounce of criticism for his personality and has proven he can't change.  I can easily praise JD for his performance and civility.   We need way more that and less of Trump.  

[TT-SEA]

5 minutes ago, Thermal Trough said:

Oh where did you hear that? I heard it was Trump who was holding up a Fox debate. This is according to Bret Baier.

https://thehill.com/homenews/media/4898291-bret-baier-trump-not-harris-debate-holdup-fox-news

Trump has to be even more hesitant now.   Not only would have to beat Kamala but he would have to beat Vance's performance and that is not going to happen.   And he knows it.  

[Rubus Leucodermis]

Walz lost, but it was close. It was not a blowout loss like Biden in the first debate and Trump in the second.

[TT-SEA]

On Mark Halperin's post debate podcast he said Trump is going to be jealous and agreed that by tomorrow Trump will blow up any good that came from this debate.   He and his guests also think Vance has paved the way to be the next generation leader of the Republican party and many in the party will be very pleased to go in a less crazy direction.  

[Sunriver Snow Zone]

11 minutes ago, Rubus Leucodermis said:

Walz lost, but it was close. It was not a blowout loss like Biden in the first debate and Trump in the second.

Agreed. Biggest moment for him was the Tiananmen Square lie, that was rough, that lost him the debate. Other than that they preformed pretty similarly, but I would say that throughout vance came off a bit better

To be honest, I'm surprised him lying about his military service wasn't brought up.

[TT-SEA]

Just now, Sunriver Snow Zone said:

Agreed. Biggest moment for him was the Tiananmen Square lie, that was rough, that lost him the debate, other than that they preformed pretty similarly 

To be honest, I'm surprised him lying about his military service wasn't brought up.

He ended up saying he misspoke when pressed again... but just lead with that.   So stupid.    

[Sunriver Snow Zone]

Now that I think about it, Trump probably gained votes from this (which I did not expect coming into the debate), a lot of people felt uneasy about Vance and didn't have much of an image of him yet, now they do and it was a good one.

Probably didn't gain a ton of votes but even a few hundred or a couple thousand really is something in a close election, every vote counts in Pennsylvania.

[Rubus Leucodermis]

Just now, Sunriver Snow Zone said:

Now that I think about it, Trump probably gained votes from this (which I did not expect coming into the debate), a lot of people felt uneasy about Vance and didn't have much of an image of him yet, now they do and it was a good one.

Probably didn't gain a ton of votes but even a couple thousand really is something in a close election, every vote counts in Pennsylvania.

Not much. Might not even be measurable. It was a VP debate, not a Presidential one, and it was close.

And as @TT-SEA has been saying, Trump will say some crazy sh*t soon enough and then everyone will be back to talking about how crazy Trump is.

[TT-SEA]

Just now, Sunriver Snow Zone said:

Now that I think about it, Trump probably gained votes from this (which I did not expect coming into the debate), a lot of people felt uneasy about Vance and didn't have much of an image of him yet, now they do and it was a good one.

Probably didn't gain a ton of votes but even a couple thousand really is something in a close election, every vote counts in Pennsylvania.

Ehhhh... I get a sense it might go a little the other way and Vance just contrasts so starkly how bad Trump is. 

Even Sean Spicer echoed what he was hearing after the debate with people emphatically saying why isn't JD on topic of the ticket?? 

[TT-SEA]

1 minute ago, Rubus Leucodermis said:

Not much. Might not even be measurable. It was a VP debate, not a Presidential one, and it was close.

And as @TT-SEA has been saying, Trump will say some crazy sh*t soon enough and then everyone will be back to talking about how crazy Trump is.

Exactly... now when Trump goes off with his usual nonsense rants people will just think it doesn't have to be this way with Vance.   

[GHweatherChris]

3 minutes ago, TT-SEA said:

Ehhhh... I get a sense it might go a little the other way and Vance just contrasts so starkly how bad Trump is. 

Even Sean Spicer echoed what he was hearing after the debate with people emphatically saying why isn't JD on topic of the ticket?? 

Your typos have been increasing exponentially, that's what happens when you are in the manic stage.

[GHweatherChris]

31 minutes ago, TT-SEA said:

Absolutely when it comes to Trump.    He deserves every ounce of criticism for his personality and has proven he can't change.  I can easily praise JD for his performance and civility.   We need way more that and less of Trump.  

Missed a word there.

[TT-SEA]

1 minute ago, GHweatherChris said:

Your typos have been increasing exponentially, that's what happens when you are in the manic stage.

How am I manic?   Right now I am watching Megyn Kelley and her guests and checking back in here at times.   Not checking for all typos... don't care that much.

[TT-SEA]

2 minutes ago, GHweatherChris said:

Missed a word there.

Noone knows for sure.

[snow_wizard]

1 hour ago, TT-SEA said:

And tomorrow Trump will be praising JD (rightfully so) and then go right back to his extremely divisive rhetoric and completely ruin the good vibes from this debate.   

It sounds like you think Vance won.

[GHweatherChris]

1 hour ago, TT-SEA said:

Yeah... Dems screwed themselves by not convincing and 80 year old Biden to not run in the first place.    They got stuck with Kamala because anything else would be way too messy.

The MAGA cult decided on Trump again.   But that might not be a winning stategy.

huh?

[GHweatherChris]

3 minutes ago, TT-SEA said:

Noone knows for sure.

It wasn't a question, MANIC!!

[TT-SEA]

Just now, snow_wizard said:

It sounds like you think Vance won.

For sure.   I said he did great.   I would definitely consider voting for Vance but not Trump.   Probably not alone in that view.  

[TT-SEA]

Just now, GHweatherChris said:

It wasn't a question, MANIC!!

Noone knows... or cares.

[GHweatherChris]

1 minute ago, TT-SEA said:

Noone knows... or cares.

Deflecting and manic.

[TT-SEA]

10 minutes ago, GHweatherChris said:

huh?

That word needs to be capitalized as it is a one-word sentence.   Calm down Chris and stop maniacally posting about grammar errors and focus on your own grammar errors.   Deep breaths buddy.   You are being manic.

[snow_wizard]

I've been wondering for a while why the Vegas odds makers favored Walz in the debate.  The people who bet on Vance are probably going to double their money or so.  I would be nervous to bet on something like that though.  Who has the say on who won?

[GHweatherChris]

8 minutes ago, TT-SEA said:

That word needs to be capitalized as it is a one-word sentence.   Calm down Chris and stop maniacally posting about grammar errors and focus on your own grammar errors.   Deep breaths buddy.   You are being manic.

Best of luck to your wife through these trying times.  Please don't fill out her ballot though, that is voter fraud.

[Groundhog]

Walz continued with his “knucklehead” persona. Not the first time he’s done this routine of, “I don’t speak none too good.” I don’t know how you misspeak or misremember about such things as were you in the US or China during Tiananmen Square. Good grief, as a 10-year-old kid I can remember where I was seeing this on the news. Walz is turning into Sgt. Schultz rather than a folksy, awe-shucks! kinda guy. 

[TT-SEA]

6 minutes ago, snow_wizard said:

I've been wondering for a while why the Vegas odds makers favored Walz in the debate.  The people who bet on Vance are probably going to double their money or so.  I would be nervous to bet on something like that though.  Who has the say on who won?

They must have some objective way of judging but that seems pretty sketchy for Vegas.   There are usually clear cut ways of determining a win or loss on bets.

[Hoosier]

In terms of who won, the CNN instant poll had Vance 51% and Walz 49%.  Poll had a little larger Dem sampling.  

Both candidates' favorability ratings spiked quite a bit after the debate.  Vance net favorability went from being way, way underwater (-22) to only slightly under at -3.

[SilverFallsAndrew]

New poll out of Wisconsin. Trump +1

[Chewbacca Defense]

12 minutes ago, snow_wizard said:

I've been wondering for a while why the Vegas odds makers favored Walz in the debate.  The people who bet on Vance are probably going to double their money or so.  I would be nervous to bet on something like that though.  Who has the say on who won?

Because so far most of Vance's public appearances have been pretty cringy, but I have to say, I don't like his policies and don't ever see a world where I would vote for him for POTAS, but I thought he did pretty good tonight, and  I do appreciate the civility that was shown by both sides. 

 

I did not get to watch the whole thing, but from what I did see, the one thing I did not like was the fact he was not willing to say that Trump lost in 2020.  Sure, he would have pissed off the MAGA meatheads, but I think he might have given some undecided voters something to think about if he owned up on that.  But, I guess since he is an election denier himself, he probably would have gotten himself in more trouble in the end....

[TT-SEA]

7 minutes ago, Chewbacca Defense said:

Because so far most of Vance's public appearances have been pretty cringy, but I have to say, I don't like his policies and don't ever see a world where I would vote for him for POTAS, but I thought he did pretty good tonight, and  I do appreciate the civility that was shown by both sides. 

 

I did not get to watch the whole thing, but from what I did see, the one thing I did not like was the fact he was not willing to say that Trump lost in 2020.  Sure, he would have pissed off the MAGA meatheads, but I think he might have given some undecided voters something to think about if he owned up on that.  But, I guess since he is an election denier himself, he probably would have gotten himself in more trouble in the end....

Yeah... Kamala team is running with the election denial thing.   Pretty big deal.   Bigger issue than where Walz was in the summer of 1989.   But Walz was a mess answering that and didn't need to be... just admit he had timing wrong.  

[SilverFallsAndrew]

The president up big in Montana. 

[Hoosier]

6 minutes ago, TT-SEA said:

Yeah... Kamala team is running with the election denial thing.   Pretty big deal.   Bigger issue than where Walz was in the summer of 1989.   But Walz was a mess answering that and didn't need to be... just admit he had timing wrong.  

Yeah, I kept waiting for Walz to give an answer to that question about when he was in China.  Waiting and waiting, and then the ultimate response pretty much sucked.

Vance's answer on 2020 was perhaps his weakest moment.  Not surprised that he handled it the way he did, but it didn't play well.  Happened like 85 minutes into the debate, but it may be the thing most likely to live on for a while in a debate that was pretty unremarkable overall.