May 2020 Weather discussion for the PNW

[Phil]

That sounds pretty good actually, I almost believed the tofu though, that stuff is nasty.

I’d eat tofu over beef anytime. That stuff is nasty.

[Phil]

Yep. It is what it is... and with a Nina developing it might continue for quite awhile. Helps to keep expectations low.

Another warmer than average May, and you’re still not satisfied? You just need it torch all the time, don’t you?

 

God forbid summer end up 0.5°F below average. Or even average. Oh, the horror. It’s been 8 years since the last “normal” PNW, and almost a decade since the last cool one...probably due for a course correction.

[TT-SEA]

Another warmer than average May, and you’re still not satisfied? You just need it torch all the time, don’t you?

 

God forbid summer end up 0.5°F below average. Or even average. Oh, the horror. It’s been 8 years since the last “normal” PNW, and almost a decade since the last cool one...probably due for a course correction.

Preferences are so important!

 

We can easily move if we don't like it.

[Front Ranger]

Very true! But weak effort on your part to streeeeeetch.

 

I think its nice to see the sun. That is all. Nothing more.

 

Intentionally weak. And stoic.

[Phil]

True, but there is some potential inherent hypocrisy, at least on the surface, to seek ways to frame our warming climate in a more dismissive way while taking most if not all opportunities to highlight the virus’ severity. They’re both similar in that they’re both without a ton of definitive answers and both heavily politicized. Worth considering while we’re on the topic of hypocrisy...

The virus is killing hundreds of thousands of people as we speak. Meanwhile, weather/climate related deaths have been decreasing for over a century, famine is at the lowest levels per capita in recorded history, and food production is at an all time high.

 

The comparison makes zero sense.

[Omegaraptor]

Another warmer than average May, and you’re still not satisfied? You just need it torch all the time, don’t you?

 

God forbid summer end up 0.5°F below average. Or even average. Oh, the horror. It’s been 8 years since the last “normal” PNW, and almost a decade since the last cool one...probably due for a course correction.

 

Tim's talking about it being wetter than average.

 

He really needs to move south or east.

[Deweydog]

The virus is killing hundreds of thousands of people as we speak. Meanwhile, weather/climate related deaths have been decreasing for over a century, famine is at the lowest levels per capita in recorded history, and food production is at an all time high.

 

The comparison makes zero sense.

The fact you think it makes zero sense speaks volumes.

[Jesse]

Sure. And none of us are immune.

How does it go in the courtroom when you pull out the “yeah but we’re all bad” card?

[TT-SEA]

Tim's talking about it being wetter than average.

 

He really needs to move south or east.

It has been much wetter than nornal here. No debate.

[Front Ranger]

The virus is killing hundreds of thousands of people as we speak. Meanwhile, weather/climate related deaths have been decreasing for over a century, famine is at the lowest levels per capita in recorded history, and food production is at an all time high.

 

The comparison makes zero sense.

 

Yeah, the biggest differences are that climate change's catastrophes are much more theoretical, and obviously it's occurring at a much slower pace than the virus.

[Deweydog]

[Front Ranger]

Tim and Randy have indeed lived in a favored zone. Tim would not have to move very far at all to find much drier conditions.

 

 

 

[Deweydog]

[Jesse]

[Front Ranger]

Maybe you shouldn’t have opened the door to comparing weather and virus analysis...

 

Unfortunately the door swings both ways.

 

Forget to add your point? Or address someone else's?

[Phil]

The fact you think it makes zero sense speaks volumes.

What speaks volumes is your deflective non-response right here.

 

Maybe don’t compare two vastly different dilemmas if you don’t know what the hell you’re talking about?

[Phil]

[Deweydog]

What speaks volumes is your deflective non-response right here.

 

Maybe don’t compare two vastly different dilemmas if you don’t know what the hell you’re talking about?

That was already addressed. I’ll give you a pass on reading comprehension given the stressful times and the fact that remote learning is not optimal.

 

The comparison is in the framing of something about which is knowledge is somewhat limited. Both have data points that can be easily cherry picked and manipulated somewhat to fit a narrative. To call the comparison completely nonsensical reeks of defensiveness.

[Jesse]

That was already addressed. I’ll give you a pass on reading comprehension given the stressful times and the fact that remote learning is not optimal.

The comparison is in the framing of something about which is knowledge is somewhat limited. Both have data points that can be easily cherry picked and manipulated somewhat to fit a narrative. To call the comparison completely nonsensical reeks of defensiveness.

The first paragraph is just completely unnecessary personal nonsense, and tangent to the discussion. Weren’t you just reading me the riot act the other day for needless tim hominem?

[Phil]

[Deweydog]

[Jesse]

This forum can be split into three groups. Wx-enthusiasts, trolls who are wx-enthusiasts(hi), and just plain trolls.

I think we’re dealing with group #3 here.

Nah. Matt is a weather enthusiast. I wouldn’t call him a troll either. Although he definitely goes out of his way to push buttons sometimes, I think he generally believes/is sincere with what he is saying, which I can respect even if I don’t always agree with it.

[Front Ranger]

That was already addressed. I’ll give you a pass on reading comprehension given the stressful times and the fact that remote learning is not optimal.

 

The comparison is in the framing of something about which is knowledge is somewhat limited. Both have data points that can be easily cherry picked and manipulated somewhat to fit a narrative. To call the comparison completely nonsensical reeks of defensiveness.

 

He made a fair point, though. What isn't debatable is that the virus is currently killing a lot more people.

[MossMan]

Quiet morning at the lake when I was there briefly this AM.

[jcmcgaffey]

Tim and Randy have indeed lived in a favored zone. Tim would not have to move very far at all to find much drier conditions.

 

WaterPNormWRCC-NW.png

SEA and WFO are above average but showing up below average on that map.

[Deweydog]

He made a fair point, though. What isn't debatable is that the virus is currently killing a lot more people.

I agree with the point. But there are some apt comparisons. To fail to acknowledge that in any way is intellectually dishonest and a pretty clear sign of an agenda.

[Jesse]

SEA and WFO are above average but showing up below average on that map.

Did you look for any places that are below average but showing up as above average?

[TT-SEA]

Tim and Randy have indeed lived in a favored zone. Tim would not have to move very far at all to find much drier conditions.

 

WaterPNormWRCC-NW.png

Side note... Seattle is above normal for the year and since October 1st. That map is inaccurate for the Seattle to Olympia area as noted before due to 4 problem stations. So I would have to go a little farther away in that direction.

[TT-SEA]

Did you look for any places that are below average but showing up as above average?

Nature of the map means that can't happen unless stations are over-reporting rain. That is much less likely than missing days. The issue for the Seattle to Olympia area is easy to prove and always runs drier than reality.

[Front Ranger]

SEA and WFO are above average but showing up below average on that map.

 

It runs a little dry in some areas. But the general trends are accurate.

 

It's been wetter in the WA Cascade foothills, more than any other PNW lowland location. And most of the PNW is actually below normal.

[Phil]

That was already addressed. I’ll give you a pass on reading comprehension given the stressful times and the fact that remote learning is not optimal.

 

The comparison is in the framing of something about which is knowledge is somewhat limited. Both have data points that can be easily cherry picked and manipulated somewhat to fit a narrative. To call the comparison completely nonsensical reeks of defensiveness.

First paragraph is just you being butthurt. I’m sorry if I hurt your feelings.

 

Second paragraph is true on its face, but doesn’t substantiate your assertion of hypocrisy, because they’re also vastly different issues. Again, Covid-19 has killed hundreds of thousands of people in the span a few months, and forced the most prolific global recession since the Great Depression. This is obvious on its face.

 

Meanwhile, there is zero evidence to suggest deaths are increasing from weather/climate change. In fact it’s the *opposite*, as far as the data is concerned. The rapid increase in the human population/life expectancy, in tandem with declining famine and increased agricultural output, demonstrates this clearly.

 

So no, they’re not analogous issues within the framework you’re implying. And there’s nothing hypocritical about taking different perspectives on two vastly different dilemmas.

[TT-SEA]

It runs a little dry in some areas. But the general trends are accurate.

 

It's been wetter in the WA Cascade foothills, more than any other PNW lowland location. And most of the PNW is actually below normal.

Yeah... nature is stuck in a rut and the same areas are usually wetter than normal. Its been like that for years with the exception of 2019.

[Phil]

[GHweatherChris]

[Deweydog]

First paragraph is just you being butthurt. I’m sorry if I hurt your feelings.

 

Second paragraph is true on its face, but doesn’t substantiate your assertion of hypocrisy, because they’re also vastly different issues. Again, Covid-19 has killed hundreds of thousands of people in the span a few months, and forced the most prolific global recession since the Great Depression. This is obvious on its face.

 

Meanwhile, there is zero evidence to suggest deaths are increasing from weather/climate change. In fact it’s the *opposite*, as far as the data is concerned. The rapid increase in the human population/life expectancy, in tandem with declining famine and increased agricultural output, demonstrates this clearly.

 

So no, they’re not analogous issues within the framework you’re implying. And there’s nothing hypocritical about taking different perspectives on two vastly different dilemmas.

Of course they’re different issues. Vastly different. One requires emergent action while the other may not require any action at all.

 

The point is that in an effort to take a steadfast position on the virus, there’s some overdramatization, manipulation and cherry picking of facts to fit what is the preferred narrative. The same occurs within the climate debate. The hypocrisy lies in the fact that a few folks here are first to the bar to order up a drink to minimize warming (not its impacts, mind you) while taking a fairly alarmist stance with the virus.

[Jesse]

[Phil]

I agree with the point. But there are some apt comparisons. To fail to acknowledge that in any way is intellectually dishonest and a pretty clear sign of an agenda.

What “apt” comparisons? All you said was covid-19 and climate warming both contain uncertainties and are open to data manipulation. So what? That’s true of everything in systems science(s). How do you make the giant leap from that to “anyone taking different perspectives on different issues is hypocritical”? You must have the intellectual curiosity of a slug to hold such an ignorant view of things.

 

Earth and Mars are both planets, both orbit around the same star, both have water on their surfaces and in their atmospheres. Therefore, both must harbor life, and anyone taking a different perspective on Mar’s habitability vs Earth’s habitability is a hypocrite.

[Deweydog]

[Phil]

I feel like you're bull sh*tting here..

About what?

[Jesse]

Translation: I agree with you but I’m afraid to say because I must stick to my shtick.

A sticky shtick can be a sign you live in a VERY humid climate.

It’s not black and white. I agree to some extent with the broader point, but just because something is technically correct doesn’t mean it isn’t a deflection meant to shield some 1’s favorite devilish underdog to advocate 4 from a well-earned line of attack.